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18 November 2012 @ 02:59 pm
This is likely to stir up a hornet's nest, but I'm in the mood.

Okay, shipping. What exactly does this entail? Is there a mandatory sexual element? Must there be? And just because a segment of fandom adheres to a particular ship, should The Powers That Be and the actors involved in the fantasy ship be obligated to listen to/tolerate/agree with this shippery?

Little back-story: I listened to an interview with Misha Collins on Winchester Radio
a few days ago and they took caller questions, unscreened. (Probably not the wisest idea.) The last one was courtesy of a weepy young lady who was desperate for Misha to comment on 'Destiel'. He hemmed and hawed and tap-danced around it, she kept pushing, and it all ended up feeling very awkward. About the same time, an essay
popped up on my tumblr dash concerning how good it is that shipping come out of the closet, particularly for the LGBT community (with specific reference to Destiel).

Now, my brother is gay. I read NC-17 slashy fanfic. I'm not a homophobe but as a woman married to a dude, I'm in no position to adjudicate what it's like to be gay or bi. Nor do I feel like we, as a fandom, have the right to bully the show's writers/actors into compliance with ANY of our wishes unless they damned well feel like addressing the topic. And if certain fans are too socially ass-backward to suss out when they're making someone uncomfortable, do we not have the right to comment? Do we not have the right to put a foot down?

There's been a lot of talk about 'shaming' ... ship-shaming, kink-shaming, etc. and how we shouldn't tolerate it. We're all freaks of some stripe; who are we to judge? But there ARE LINES, folks. When we begin to make someone else uncomfortable, we need to back the fuck off and rethink our tactics. Criminy, put yourself in their shoes. Yes, you have the right to say what you want. Guess what? SO DO THEY.

Please don’t shove your ship in anyone’s face and expect them to put their blessing on it, especially not in public. Please don’t assume that shipping is some greater societal statement. Write your own story; let others write theirs.

All comments welcomed, but pleeeease, stay civil, 'kay?
Current Mood: contemplativecontemplative
Current Music: 'What If We Give It Away' - REM
borgmama1of5: Mollyborgmama1of5 on November 18th, 2012 10:14 pm (UTC)
"but it has also fostered an unhealthy attitude of entitlement in some...parts of fandom"

I think that comment can be used across the board when discussing fandom, not just shipping--the amount of vitriol I see when the writers take the story in a different direction than a fan wants...It is frustrating that fans don't grasp that the show cannot be written to their specifications because every fan wants something different! I'm not talking about mild kvetching about plot holes, or expressing dismay that the story is going differently than anticipated (I'm guilty), but the fans who seem to feel entitled to have the show written just for them.

The existence of fanfic, etc. allows us to divert the show into our own personal paths, but the show as it is given to us is not for us to control.

And I just don't get hateful comments! If you don't like it anymore, don't watch!
auroramama on November 18th, 2012 10:49 pm (UTC)
Well, if network executives can ruin a show they know nothing about, and they can and do, I don't feel I have to blush for presumptuous fans. At least they care for the shows they criticize. Even angry, hateful comments usually come from disappointed love.
The indefatigable Mrs. Griffinquickreaver on November 18th, 2012 11:10 pm (UTC)
Re: heartbreak
"We only hurt the ones we love"? Or maybe "The road to hell is paved with good intentions"...

Writing a TV show is a WHOLE 'nother animal to writing fanfic or even regular ol' fiction. I do feel like presumptuous fans need to take a breath and a step back. It is not their own personal intellectual property. They can kvetch all they want but it's not their story to tell, period.

But then I feel the same way about network executives sometimes (except Mark Pedowitz who loves SPN; he's kinda awesome.) For them, it's all about the numbers and dumbing things down to the lowest common denominator. If a show isn't bringing in the numbers and $$, it's gone.

Here's a funny little anecdote: I do digital book covers in my dayjob. I was told, many years ago, to change a cover's color scheme from green to blue because "green doesn't sell." I was all like "Wuh?" But the next time you go to a bookstore (if they even have bookstores any more), count the number of green covers. You won't find many, and why? Because for whatever dumb reason, they don't sell. Baffles me. But it won't matter how beautiful the cover is if it doesn't move the product. There's certainly a modicum of that in network TV, sad but true.
monicawoe: Between-Sammonicawoe on November 19th, 2012 01:08 am (UTC)
That "green doesn't sell" bit is fascinating to me. Granted this isn't the cover, but one of my favorite books, 'Die Unendliche Geschichte' (original German version of the Neverending Story) is written almost entirely in red and green ink to distinguish between realities. That's one of the reasons why I love it so much.

The indefatigable Mrs. Griffinquickreaver on November 19th, 2012 01:37 am (UTC)
That's doubly interesting because red and green together generate visual energy (as complimentary colors.) You know how when your eyes get tired, your vision gets swimmy looking at certain colors? It's the light waves effecting each other. Also, red is hard to read in smaller fonts. But I can't see them using blue/orange instead. So I guess it works!
ratherastoryratherastory on November 19th, 2012 07:57 pm (UTC)
I love that story! I have the German version (though it's slightly too advanced for me, alas). A point of interest, in English the parts that take place in "reality" are in italics. No change in colour.
Amberamberdreams on November 20th, 2012 11:41 am (UTC)
Oh! I was lucky then, I have an English copy (hard back) that has the different coloured fonts in it. I love it.
Charity: [Anime] a feudal fairytalecherry916 on November 19th, 2012 08:20 am (UTC)
Also to mention.

Producing a TV show is SO SO much different then writing fanfic. I see some fans claim they can do better but writing fanfic only takes A) creativity and B) writing skills. You can literally take it in all directions which is why some fans presume they can do better but while writing a tv show you're limited by money, props, casting, how far CGI can take you etc. a lot of limits.

They're two totally different ball games which is why I wish some fans would stop comparing the two :/
The indefatigable Mrs. Griffinquickreaver on November 19th, 2012 06:13 pm (UTC)
I listen to a really awesome podcast called The Nerdist: Writer's Panel. It's hosted by Ben Blacker, who wrote for Supernatural ages ago. He has interviewed a ton of TV writers and it's unendingly interesting to me! (I get it via iTunes but you can google it too.)

It really demonstrates how hard writing for TV is. I don't envy the writers one bit. (Now, that doesn't mean I forgive them for stupid scripts *cough-TimeForAWedding-cough*, but I have a little more mercy towards them, perhaps.)
ratherastoryratherastory on November 19th, 2012 07:59 pm (UTC)
Are there actually people who say that? God. /o\

I know some people sometimes joking tell me and other authors we should write for the show, but it's just that—a joke. There's no way that 90% of what's found in fanfic could ever be realistically reproduced on TV. That's the joy of fanfic: doing what we know will likely never be on our screens.